Fixing DJI's Compass Problem

SeanAxiom · Jul 11, 2014

Same problem here in Vancouver, Canada: +16.7 declination
Had this problem with my P1.1 and now with P2. I posted on the DJI post asking for TESTERS as well

Andy T · Jul 11, 2014

Great time to apply a bit of pressure to DJI to keep the issue on top of their pile instead of shoving it down like they did last time. Nothing fancy , just a post or two to their Facebook or on their YouTube videos would suffice

varmint · Jul 11, 2014

ianwood said:
I can confirm we should be getting something around the end of this week. Whether it's another beta or a release I am not sure.

End of the week is here. Still nothing I assume, Ian?

twistedme · Jul 11, 2014

After my crash (lost control) I fly in ATTI only. Yesterday reading this thread I decided to do my tests, results:

http://youtu.be/2Yh-PLo52Pc

Location - Poland

Andy T · Jul 11, 2014

varmint said:
ianwood said:

I can confirm we should be getting something around the end of this week. Whether it's another beta or a release I am not sure.

Click to expand...

End of the week is here. Still nothing I assume, Ian?

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=11555&start=630#p183563

Lenny7118 · Jul 11, 2014

DJI is never coming out with a fix ! They just don't give a crap going by their past history. No fix being released even though they have a working beta 3.05 firmware that fixes most of the problem. DJI just make the general release to the public so everyone can fly their phantoms without TBE and J Hooking. The beta testers aren't complaining because they got the 3.05 firmware and are flying straight without the problems. So where's the outcry from them now for a fix ?? Oh I forgot they got their fix.
Just go back to when the first Zenmuse gimbal was released with all the problems , DJI never admitted to the problem nor did they make a public statement on the problem, lastly they never fixed it. So follow phantom owners don't expect the current problem to be fixed. It's been 4 months , that's enough time. DJI release the 3.05 firmware and if there's no big push for it to be released they won't.
Thank you.

P.S. Another Beta firmware if released to the testers doesn't cut it. RELEASE the firmware to us all.

Erwan · Jul 11, 2014

+1 More than time for a release !!! been more than a while now. Phantom needs to fly straight not stay in case...****!

SlyMaddog · Jul 11, 2014

So glad I found this forum.. Add me in.. I'm getting the same results.. I live in the SoCal area (Los Angeles).. I received my Phantom 2 last week and after I updated to the latest FW (3.04) I was getting the same symptoms that everyone else is getting.. I've flown 5 flights so far and always the same results.. When I launch the Phantom 2 and hover it will immediately start to slightly drift to it's right which causes me to constantly adjust to maintain the phantom in one area (but I get no TBE). After 30 seconds or so it will stable and hover in a stationary pattern. So to test what everyone else was doing I flew the Phantom heading forward at about half stick for 30 yards or so.. The Phantom would maintain a straight course but as soon as I released all sticks to their center the phantom would immediate drift to it's left at about a 45 degree angle.. When bringing the phantom straight back I would get the same results except it would now head off to it's right in a 45 degree angle after sticks were centered.. This pattern would continue until about 6 minutes into my flying and all drifting would stop. Upon landing and starting with a fresh battery the same pattern would repeat itself..

Ok, so initially I thought this was a "normal" characteristic with DJI products and never really thought much about it since I would adjust my flying to compensate.... But now I wonder.. I also fly a X650, QAV500 and a 800mm Hex and all flying with DJI WKM FC's.. And they all exhibit the same flying characteristics as the Phantom 2..?

varmint · Jul 11, 2014

Andy T said:
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=11555&start=630#p183563

Ah, great, thanks.

Aerial Entertainment Studios · Jul 12, 2014

Hello all, here is a copy of a letter I just sent to DJI customer service following a crash due to the magnetic declination issue. I purchased a brand new unit and facing the same issue.

Let me know if anyone has sent letters like this previously.

Hello,

I purchased a second Vision+ in Hong Kong a few weeks ago and brought it with me on holidays in Canada (Eastern Quebec area) and have experienced a scary crash that could have gravely injured people. This crash occurred due to a severe magnetic declination issue that was not handled properly by your firmware and flight controller. The Vision+ crashed in the water (luckily not hitting anyone) and I was able to recover the footage from the memory card. The video below shows a very severe ‘toilet bowl’ effect that occurred 10 seconds before the Vision+ took a dive into the water after doing one more large and uncontrolled circle. See video below that is taken directly from my memory card.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivnI8csyxdE

As a result of this, my Vision+ is destroyed and I feel this is DJI’s responsibility as the issue was related to a compass problem that was not under my control. I am therefore asking for proper compensation for the loss of this unit.

As a loyal customer, I have now purchased a replacement unit while I am on holiday in Canada (purchased from one of your dealers in Canada). However, after setting-up the new unit and completing the compass calibration, I am facing the EXACT SAME ISSUE (toilet bowl effect) straight out of the box. This is NOT NORMAL.

I therefore conclude this is a magnetic declination issue that is not properly managed by your firmware. This needs to be addressed immediately as it represents a serious risk for anyone who owns one of your products. Flying your product in certain areas therefore becomes dangerous and the software from your company cannot be trusted. This is unacceptable.

I am therefore asking you for a few things:

1- Compensate me for the total loss of my Vision+ that crashed in the water due to the compass issue.

2- Fix the magnetic declination issue by updating your firmware and taking into consideration the worldwide magnetic declination map.

I am asking for a quick follow-up on this request and will not hesitate to elevate this further if your response is not satisfactory.

Please follow-up,

Yours truly,

Patrice Gaucher LL.B.

tom3holer · Jul 12, 2014

I feel for your loss as I have also lost a P2 due to another DJI issue.
The letter well done but if you have the card why is the crash not on the video?
If it were, DJI would have proof and I suspect offer a replacement.

You can, by rotating the compass, compensate for the toilet bowl and j hooking very effectively. It is not a fix but will make the machine very flyable. It is documented here on the forum many times. You rotate the compass opposite to the TBE rotation.
In your case rotate it approx. 30 deg CCW and make sure it is fixed in that position so as bot to come loose.

Tom

Andy T · Jul 12, 2014

pgaucher said:
Hello all, here is a copy of a letter I just sent to DJI customer service following a crash due to the magnetic declination issue. I purchased a brand new unit and facing the same issue.

Let me know if anyone has sent letters like this previously.
*snip*
Patrice Gaucher LL.B.

I have also had a crash and several near misses because of declination. Luckily my machine survived. I have contacted my dealer and am on DJIs case fairly regularly on their social media. If I come across an employee on YouTube or something I will hit them up as well. The fix for this problem has been delayed because there are actually very few complaints on DJI social media about this. I have tried to get people to post there but it is difficult. I hear ya man. Good luck!

droneranger · Jul 12, 2014

pgaucher said:
Hello all, here is a copy of a letter I just sent to DJI customer service following a crash due to the magnetic declination issue. I purchased a brand new unit and facing the same issue.

Let me know if anyone has sent letters like this previously.

Hello,

I purchased a second Vision+ in Hong Kong a few weeks ago and brought it with me on holidays in Canada (Eastern Quebec area) and have experienced a scary crash that could have gravely injured people. This crash occurred due to a severe magnetic declination issue that was not handled properly by your firmware and flight controller. The Vision+ crashed in the water (luckily not hitting anyone) and I was able to recover the footage from the memory card. The video below shows a very severe ‘toilet bowl’ effect that occurred 10 seconds before the Vision+ took a dive into the water after doing one more large and uncontrolled circle. See video below that is taken directly from my memory card.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivnI8csyxdE

As a result of this, my Vision+ is destroyed and I feel this is DJI’s responsibility as the issue was related to a compass problem that was not under my control. I am therefore asking for proper compensation for the loss of this unit.

As a loyal customer, I have now purchased a replacement unit while I am on holiday in Canada (purchased from one of your dealers in Canada). However, after setting-up the new unit and completing the compass calibration, I am facing the EXACT SAME ISSUE (toilet bowl effect) straight out of the box. This is NOT NORMAL.

I therefore conclude this is a magnetic declination issue that is not properly managed by your firmware. This needs to be addressed immediately as it represents a serious risk for anyone who owns one of your products. Flying your product in certain areas therefore becomes dangerous and the software from your company cannot be trusted. This is unacceptable.

I am therefore asking you for a few things:

1- Compensate me for the total loss of my Vision+ that crashed in the water due to the compass issue.

2- Fix the magnetic declination issue by updating your firmware and taking into consideration the worldwide magnetic declination map.

I am asking for a quick follow-up on this request and will not hesitate to elevate this further if your response is not satisfactory.

Please follow-up,

Yours truly,

Patrice Gaucher LL.B.

Excellent letter!

Please keep the forum posted on DJI's response(s).

Aerial Entertainment Studios · Jul 12, 2014

We don't see the crash on the video because I was never able to stop the recording before the crash occurred and the Phantom spent 4 days under cold salt water. A local fisherman recovered it after the passage of hurricane Arthur and I was lucky enough to recover the memory card. However, the final video file was corrupt so I needed to use a video recovery software in order to view the file. Doing this however cut out the last 10-15 seconds (hence we don't see the actual crash).

Having said this, there is plenty of footage showing a large toilet bowl so I hope DJI is responsible enough to recognize this is an issue with their firmware.

Worst case scenario, I sue them.

What we would need is for someone to actually get hurt enough because of this issue and then bring DJI to court for criminal negligence. They know about this issue and are doing nothing about it. Even worse, there are no warnings when you purchase the product that it could be susceptible to magnetic declination and advising users about this problem. Knowing about an issue and not doing anything about it is negligence. If someone gets injured (or worse) due to this negligence, than this is a whole other ball game.

I really hope someone at DJI is reading these forums because I am not joking around.

If I flew the thing in a careless manner and injured someone, that would be my full responsibility. However, if the crash is due to a defective software and not under the user's control, then DJI has that responsibility.

We need to elevate this a notch. It is only a question of time before someone gets hit in the face by a rogue Phantom traveling at 65 km/hour.

Andy T · Jul 12, 2014

pgaucher said:
We don't see the crash... *snip*
I really hope someone at DJI is reading these forums because I am not joking around.
*snip*.

They may not take posts here too seriously but probably pay more attention to posts here https://www.facebook.com/DJIglobal
They sometimes even post responses there. I would think any corporation should take each post to a Facebook page as equal to 1000 complaints or so. Few people go to the trouble of actually posting public complaints

Aerial Entertainment Studios · Jul 12, 2014

I have no issue bringing this to the public eye. I will wait to see what their response is first. If it is not to my satisfaction, I will elevate this to all social media outlets if necessary. If that doesn't work, a lawsuit in Hong Kong should send a strong signal. I live there so it's not to much of an issue for me. I've already spent $5000 on their products, what's an extra $10 000 on a lawsuit which could prevent serious injuries (or perhaps worse). Let's just hope they have the slightest sense of accountability and responsibility.

John Shaw · Jul 12, 2014

I have been puzzling over this throughout the day.
The first thing that seemed odd and got me interested was that the declination problem for TBE, JHook, and CL are lateral issues. I am not aware of a declination issue causing a dive into the sea - a vertical move.
Watching the video I was surprise how little TBE there is at the beginning of the flight. I would have expected more in eastern Quebec. I am roughly at the same declination but the opposite sign (Washington State) so I am use to seeing it. Occasionally there are moves that seem like the start of TBE or JHook but you seem to have it well under control and you seem very comfortable (being at low altitude near people). To bad you lost the end of the video and even more - the Phantom.
I welcome comments on these thoughts...

Mlaudisa · Jul 12, 2014

My current Phantom seems to be exhibiting the dreaded Magnetic Declination issues. I flew this morning, and below is the video, can someone confirm this is what is referred to as the Toilet Bowl Effect?

Here are my other observations:
1) Compass was calibrated and GPS had 10 satellites acquired
2) Flying in GPS mode
3) No wind, clear day, open field with little to no RF or WiFi interference
4) When I lifted off, the aircraft wasn't very steady; when I gave it some input to pivot right, it tilted and flew quite energetically to the right, requiring me to counter with a right stick input left

Basically, it was unflyable due to the distinct possibility of becoming out of control. Furthermore, when it would hover more or less in place, it would occasionally vibrate for a few seconds. If this resonates and seems familiar, I'd appreciate your insights, thanks.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysGevawNN0c[/youtube]

John Shaw · Jul 12, 2014

Mlaudisa said:
My current Phantom seems to be exhibiting the dreaded Magnetic Declination issues. I flew this morning, and below is the video, can someone confirm this is what is referred to as the Toilet Bowl Effect?

Here are my other observations:
1) Compass was calibrated and GPS had 10 satellites acquired
2) Flying in GPS mode
3) No wind, clear day, open field with little to no RF or WiFi interference
4) When I lifted off, the aircraft wasn't very steady; when I gave it some input to pivot right, it tilted and flew quite energetically to the right, requiring me to counter with a right stick input left

Basically, it was unflyable due to the distinct possibility of becoming out of control. Furthermore, when it would hover more or less in place, it would occasionally vibrate for a few seconds. If this resonates and seems familiar, I'd appreciate your insights, thanks.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysGevawNN0c[/youtube]

I would consider that classic TBE. What's your declination?
It does decrease with time so later into the flight you don't see it. I tended to just keep it in the open till it settled down then go for the more precise tasks. Problem is it restarts with each powerup.

Pazz · Jul 12, 2014

John Shaw said:
I have been puzzling over this throughout the day.
The first thing that seemed odd and got me interested was that the declination problem for TBE, JHook, and CL are lateral issues. I am not aware of a declination issue causing a dive into the sea - a vertical move.
Watching the video I was surprise how little TBE there is at the beginning of the flight. I would have expected more in eastern Quebec. I am roughly at the same declination but the opposite sign (Washington State) so I am use to seeing it. Occasionally there are moves that seem like the start of TBE or JHook but you seem to have it well under control and you seem very comfortable (being at low altitude near people). To bad you lost the end of the video and even more - the Phantom.
I welcome comments on these thoughts...

You are right John. Looking at the location, I can see all sorts of issues. Where did he do a good compass calibration? The area is full of cars, boats, all sorts of potential metal structures under piers, possible CB radio interference in boats etc.( I also have an big issue flying that close to people.)The other issue is flying over water at low attitude. GPS can be badly interferred by the signals reflecting off water. Most likely source of the vertical drop. Not to also mention, thermal updrafts / wind shear.
Flying over water is full of danger in GPS flight mode. Never advised, use attitude mode or manual.
DJI's big mistake was marketing this machine as an out of the box perfect flyer. The default vision mode is GPS flight. Most other manufacturers don"t do this & only use this as beginner mode with the expectation that people learn to fly them properly. Also the new breed of drones are using dual redundancy based GPS systems to mitigate GPS dropouts & improve stability.
The Phantom series has been a great marketing success, but is still needs people to understand it is serious flying machine which needs pilot input to operate successfully within its limitations.