Glad I watched this. I'm going to Vegas on Monday...was going to stop by their booth...guess I can skip them for now.
Was also coming onto this thread to ask about their 3-axis gimbals. Anyone have any experience with them?
What I'm seeing the in P2+H3-3D video's is starting to bother me; landing gear visible in right yawing turns. Lazy/tilting horizon-mostly tilting down to the right(exactly like on my 2 axis Zen)...occasional "ticks" or jerks(same on on the 2axis zen), and micro-bounce. All of these things,well most of them, need to be corrected in Post, and that's a huge PITA!!!!
Has anyone used any of the gimbals from Freefly Systems? They make the MoVI...which is a "game changer" in hand held, light weight, gimbals. It is the single most amazing piece of "kit" I've seen in years!!! That's why I went to their site and noticed they had the Cinewing, and some "custom made" gimbals. Anyone have any experience with them and their "custom made" gimbals for copters?
Is Freefly Systems just a distributor for the Cinewing?
What bothers me is; I'm seeing the flaws, in a lot of these products. And, the problem is-I don't think some people see what I see. For a "consumer/hobbyist", these things are fine. But, when you're spending 1000's, and really need a very stable platform-I'm just not finding it.
Was also coming onto this thread to ask about their 3-axis gimbals. Anyone have any experience with them?
What I'm seeing the in P2+H3-3D video's is starting to bother me; landing gear visible in right yawing turns. Lazy/tilting horizon-mostly tilting down to the right(exactly like on my 2 axis Zen)...occasional "ticks" or jerks(same on on the 2axis zen), and micro-bounce. All of these things,well most of them, need to be corrected in Post, and that's a huge PITA!!!!
Has anyone used any of the gimbals from Freefly Systems? They make the MoVI...which is a "game changer" in hand held, light weight, gimbals. It is the single most amazing piece of "kit" I've seen in years!!! That's why I went to their site and noticed they had the Cinewing, and some "custom made" gimbals. Anyone have any experience with them and their "custom made" gimbals for copters?
Is Freefly Systems just a distributor for the Cinewing?
What bothers me is; I'm seeing the flaws, in a lot of these products. And, the problem is-I don't think some people see what I see. For a "consumer/hobbyist", these things are fine. But, when you're spending 1000's, and really need a very stable platform-I'm just not finding it.
Do not bother even looking at their booth...I have another friend on this forum who got his Cinewing 6HL the other day......missing parts...was not totally assembled..antennas he upgraded and blew up the board...plus no FPV....the cheap HDMI connection broke the port on his Canon 5D...another 200 bucks down the drain...and he has not even been able to fly it yet!
Do not purchase the Turbo Ace AV200 gimbal..it is a piece of crap...much too big and too much wind resistance with the broadside blocking air in the forward movement...plus adding some expensive jello. Not stable...and not anywhere near pro quality as they advertise.
Yes, going back to the Phantom Combo with the new 3 axis gimbal. Be here Monday from Atlanta Hobby. I was really impressed with the video it produces and stability with clear and sharp subjects. Check it out..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Trw9aS22w9s#t=15
Do not purchase the Turbo Ace AV200 gimbal..it is a piece of crap...much too big and too much wind resistance with the broadside blocking air in the forward movement...plus adding some expensive jello. Not stable...and not anywhere near pro quality as they advertise.
Yes, going back to the Phantom Combo with the new 3 axis gimbal. Be here Monday from Atlanta Hobby. I was really impressed with the video it produces and stability with clear and sharp subjects. Check it out..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Trw9aS22w9s#t=15
Yea-I watched that video, and saw all kinds of issues. Notice how the horizon droops to the right?? See the landing gear leg on the right yaw?
Perhaps some things I just have to accept, I guess. Just find it hard to believe that these issues are still visible in their "premier" video.
Perhaps some things I just have to accept, I guess. Just find it hard to believe that these issues are still visible in their "premier" video.
Yes, I did notice the landing gear on the yaw....and the right drooping a bit in some takes..but i still think that this is very good quality, sharp, stable video. If I choose to use the yaw or right droop take or scene in my production that is a quick fix in FCPX. Not concerned at all about those flaws as compared to most of the crap out there people are promoting as cinema quality or broadcast quality. Especially Turbo Ace and Wowless Hobbies!
I just took a look at your video. I'm no expert but it looks a little bit different than jello. I had a similar effect on the Matrix when a prop screw was loose. I'm sure that you tightened the screws so I would expect that something else is out of whack. I didn't see the video that Wowless took until I received the Matrix and that did have jello. Yes, social media is very powerful right now. That was one of the "threats" I used to get the Matrix working as it should-that I would post complaints on every multicopter site that I could find. Wowless was very engaging during the purchase, spending plenty of time on the phone explaining things but it went way downhill afterwards with totally patronizing and wrong answers to my questions and complaints. The Matrix is pretty awesome and from now on, I will be spending my money with fpvflyamerica. I'm really thankful to have these forums for support.
What I find amazing is that I am flying the wow hobby X830D with a Canon EOS-M and a two axis gimbal, and I am getting 13min flight time with a 5300mah 3S battery. I'm not sure I see the point of going to the larger copter if your not getting any more payload or flight time.
Can you fly with a bigger battery? I'm using 8000 6S on the Matrix definitely with bigger payload and better flight time than the Phantom. It's very stable compared to the Phantom 1.
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Flyshasta - That was one of the first things I checked was that the props were seated correctly. I also used lock tight on them so they would not work out during flight and vibration. I did have one gimbal screw that came out after the first flight...so I tightened all of the gimbal screws and put a drop of lock tight on them all as well. My bird had a 10,000 mah battery and I could only get a little over 5 min. flight times until the voltage dropped to 22.2 volts. I am now gathering everything I can from Turbo Ace that is on thier site, videos, etc to document into a folder that will be sent to the AMEX investigator....Last night I re-read their return policy...It really is a joke if you need to return anything for any reason. I do not have a return authorization but FedX is picking it up tomorrow...and it is going back to Orange, Ca.....I will deal with that when the time comes. Right now just building files to document false advertising to get my *** out of this 11 grand mess up. Keep em' flying guys!
I have had the X830D for about a month it was the next step up from the P2V. I bought the P2V in December and was so excited by the capabilities but disappointed by the camera I decided to try something that would fly a camera with a decent sensor, I don't do video just stills. I am a commercial photographer by trade so this was both for work as well as an interesting hobby. I have been frustrated by the ridiculous number of frames on the market for quads and hex's and trying to figure out which motor/prop configurations would give me the lifting capability and flight time I need. I think smaller is better although maybe the larger configurations would be more stable and you could loose a motor and still land.
If you look over all the options the constant is the remote, FPV, Naza M V2, etc. These will cost the same regardless of size and the variables will be the frame, ESC's, motors, and props. It will be much cheaper to repair and operate a smaller aircraft, batteries and repairs will cost less. I would be curious to see how you like the Matrix, I am going to try a few different battery sizes with the X830D to try and optimize flight times. I think the batteries I received with the copter from wow hobbie are not the best, it looks like the 8000mah battery I got from them for $185.00 is really a zippy battery I have found elsewhere for $48.00 I have read in some of the other forums where flight times have increased a couple minutes by using a better quality battery so that's my next step. Nobody seems to make batteries with the XT-90 connector so I have to figure out how to change the connector on the batteries. The X830D with the EOS-M is giving me SLR quality images and is working well, it looks like there is a new 12mm lens on the market for the camera which should work well and I will try that next.
If you look over all the options the constant is the remote, FPV, Naza M V2, etc. These will cost the same regardless of size and the variables will be the frame, ESC's, motors, and props. It will be much cheaper to repair and operate a smaller aircraft, batteries and repairs will cost less. I would be curious to see how you like the Matrix, I am going to try a few different battery sizes with the X830D to try and optimize flight times. I think the batteries I received with the copter from wow hobbie are not the best, it looks like the 8000mah battery I got from them for $185.00 is really a zippy battery I have found elsewhere for $48.00 I have read in some of the other forums where flight times have increased a couple minutes by using a better quality battery so that's my next step. Nobody seems to make batteries with the XT-90 connector so I have to figure out how to change the connector on the batteries. The X830D with the EOS-M is giving me SLR quality images and is working well, it looks like there is a new 12mm lens on the market for the camera which should work well and I will try that next.
First time I have taken a look at this thread. That was a huge disappointment and you are totally correct to reject the whole rig. I think they have underestimated you. Having been a cop for 30yrs I admire the way you go about documenting your case. That is going to be a tidy pack of evidence to enable a lawyer to fight the case. I hope it does not come to that though. Based on their advertising claims and your evidence, if was the assessor for American Express I would refund you immediately.
I wish you well and you have more courage than I have flying that huge head chopper around the place. Enjoy your new Phantom.
Shrimpy
I wish you well and you have more courage than I have flying that huge head chopper around the place. Enjoy your new Phantom.
Shrimpy
Here is my documentation sent to AMEX along with many screen shots and video from Turbo Ace's web site.
April 6, 2014
To: Turbo Ace, Wow Hobbies, American Express
From: Gregory G Finney
After receiving the Ready to Fly Cinewing 6HL from your company 3 weeks ago
I did the required AV200 Gimbal attachment to the aircraft according to the instructions provided upon delivery. I made my first test flight a few days after using a Sony Nex-7 camera mounted on the gimbal provided. After the first flight I downloaded the video to my computer for review. Much to my amazement the vibration from the craft or gimbal created what was called “jello effect” in videography terms and was not acceptable for my upcoming high end project that I have been contracted to produce for a respected client.
The reason I chose your product to produce this high end project was from internet research and videos posted on YouTube either by your company or other individuals owning the aerial platform made by your company. These clips highlighting your product by your company stated smooth stable flight with auto stabilization from the AV 200 Gimbal, as well as flight times of 12 minutes with a much heavier camera (Canon 5D) than my Sony Nex-7. Here is your advertised video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NS8UqfBGM7s After 15 or so flights and trying different vibration dampening materials I was unable to eliminate the jello effect produced during flight. The other main concern is that flight times are much less than demonstrated by your company. The longest flight time I was able to achieve was almost 6 minutes from the provided 10,000 mah battery that was depleted to the suggested 22.2 volts and that it was fully charged by the charging equipment included in my package order. All instructions were followed for charging and the charger stated that battery was fully charged before flights.
I have created a video of my last flight,, that was yesterday morning, with all camera mounts that were provided with the kit. As you can see for yourself the jello effect is prevalent in the entire video clip. The 360 degree pan was very jerky as well as camera tilt controls, which are also demonstrated in my video. The failure of quality and stable video from your product is not what was demonstrated or advertised. Therefore I am returning the not as advertised, defective product(s) for full refund via FedX on Monday April 7, 2014.
View my testimonial video for documentation about your defective product(s
https://vimeo.com/91105721
I will be providing further documentation for your review to determine the inquiry about this claim and monetary refund for defective and not as advertised quality of your product.
Gregory G. Finney, Master Photographer PPA
gregfinneyphotography.com
[email protected]
276-356-6199
April 6, 2014
To: Turbo Ace, Wow Hobbies, American Express
From: Gregory G Finney
After receiving the Ready to Fly Cinewing 6HL from your company 3 weeks ago
I did the required AV200 Gimbal attachment to the aircraft according to the instructions provided upon delivery. I made my first test flight a few days after using a Sony Nex-7 camera mounted on the gimbal provided. After the first flight I downloaded the video to my computer for review. Much to my amazement the vibration from the craft or gimbal created what was called “jello effect” in videography terms and was not acceptable for my upcoming high end project that I have been contracted to produce for a respected client.
The reason I chose your product to produce this high end project was from internet research and videos posted on YouTube either by your company or other individuals owning the aerial platform made by your company. These clips highlighting your product by your company stated smooth stable flight with auto stabilization from the AV 200 Gimbal, as well as flight times of 12 minutes with a much heavier camera (Canon 5D) than my Sony Nex-7. Here is your advertised video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NS8UqfBGM7s After 15 or so flights and trying different vibration dampening materials I was unable to eliminate the jello effect produced during flight. The other main concern is that flight times are much less than demonstrated by your company. The longest flight time I was able to achieve was almost 6 minutes from the provided 10,000 mah battery that was depleted to the suggested 22.2 volts and that it was fully charged by the charging equipment included in my package order. All instructions were followed for charging and the charger stated that battery was fully charged before flights.
I have created a video of my last flight,, that was yesterday morning, with all camera mounts that were provided with the kit. As you can see for yourself the jello effect is prevalent in the entire video clip. The 360 degree pan was very jerky as well as camera tilt controls, which are also demonstrated in my video. The failure of quality and stable video from your product is not what was demonstrated or advertised. Therefore I am returning the not as advertised, defective product(s) for full refund via FedX on Monday April 7, 2014.
View my testimonial video for documentation about your defective product(s
https://vimeo.com/91105721
I will be providing further documentation for your review to determine the inquiry about this claim and monetary refund for defective and not as advertised quality of your product.
Gregory G. Finney, Master Photographer PPA
gregfinneyphotography.com
[email protected]
276-356-6199
I had no doubt that your props were tightened. I'm thinking that something is way out of balance to produce such crappy results. The matrix practically purrs when it's in balance. There is no doubt that you received it in unusable condition. I am worried for you about sending it back without authorization. Does this give them all the power? Were you successful in stopping payment. Can you hang on to it until successful investigation or RMA?If you want to email privately, my email is [email protected]. I returned the Matrix twice. The second time around, it took weeks to get it back. During that time, wowless did not return emails or calls. I got really paranoid and thought that I would never see it again.
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Silly question; doesn't the NEX 7 have some lenses with built-in stabilization? I know Nikon does.
What lens did you use on your maiden voyage.
What lens did you use on your maiden voyage.
The only lens I used on the flying platform was the Sony 3.5-5.6/18-55 Optical Steady Shot Lens. Yes it does have anti motion blur...but it is for still photography in low light situations. It will take 5 or 6 shots of the subject and combine them together to eliminate blur into one image. Normally I set the lens to around 21mm to eliminate the skids on the widest angle.
Thanks. Yea, I wasn't thinking about still shots....but I guess the stabilization is only good for those instances?[email protected] said:
Rumor has it the Go Pro 4 will have Electronic Stabilization!!! Now I don't know if this is the Internet wanting it so bad, that they created their own rumor, or if it's a fact.
I do know that normally, the new Go Pro's aren't released until October or November-so I'm skeptical when they say it will be released this Summer.
Also-there's no mention of it, at the NAB show in Vegas-so it appears they will only be touting their 3+, and all the cool accessories. No thanks-got the 3 black edition-not interested in a "go between"....want the NEW model!!!
That may be THE saving grace to aerial video production using this platform-onboard stabilization. Without it, the GP factor is doomed.
That would be so awesome...electronic stabilization...cameras are just like cars....they make newer and better models every year!
My Hero 3+Black will be here tomorrow with the Phantom 2 and new 3 axis gimbal with 10" monitor FPV. Going to be super windy here for the next three days so will no be able to get her airborne...have a shoot scheduled for Thur.....so hope it calms down by then.
My Hero 3+Black will be here tomorrow with the Phantom 2 and new 3 axis gimbal with 10" monitor FPV. Going to be super windy here for the next three days so will no be able to get her airborne...have a shoot scheduled for Thur.....so hope it calms down by then.
As a newbie here may I ask you a question since you've "been there done that"? Not to derail your thread (sorry but I can't seem to find a definitive answer[email protected] said:
) when it comes to the Hero camera is there a specific reason you're using a black vs a silver?Sorry all, back to regular programming! :lol:
Black shoots in Protune, at 1080/60P with manual/RAW WB. Just compare the features of the silver vs. the black. If you don't need it, then go with the silver.
If you're just doing "hobbyist" type things, you should be fine with a silver. But, for commercial use, protune works really well in timelines with footage shot with other types of camera's. It does need to be "processed" and isn't for everyone.
If you're just doing "hobbyist" type things, you should be fine with a silver. But, for commercial use, protune works really well in timelines with footage shot with other types of camera's. It does need to be "processed" and isn't for everyone.
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