Wedding video question
- Thread starter macoman
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Actually, the answer is Yes.
Any flight operation outside of hobby/recreation requires a Part 107 certificated pilot. "Money" is irrelevant.
Hobby use is defined as "Flying your drone for fun or amusement."
Having said that, is the FAA likely to "come after" you? Probably not.
Any flight operation outside of hobby/recreation requires a Part 107 certificated pilot. "Money" is irrelevant.
Hobby use is defined as "Flying your drone for fun or amusement."
Having said that, is the FAA likely to "come after" you? Probably not.
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But that's the thing... I want to do it because it's fun and it's recreational as well.
No. You're not doing it to further a business endeavor, to make a profit, or anything else that would be considered a commercial application. There's no difference between this and taking pictures with friends while you're in the park or on a hike.
People bring cameras to weddings all the time. Just so happens yours can fly. Obviously clear it with the bride & groom. Drones are very common for those epic opening shots of the venue and/or ceremony site. Maybe not so much during the ceremony. And maybe make sure guests are aware you're not a Russian spy.
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Sure and also I am not planning in flying over people. I will be flying 50 meters away from everyone. Just in case my drone lose control. I do not want to be sue.
But you are doing it for someone else. So there's a difference. But good luck and be safe.
You can not "Hobby/Recreation" FOR another person. If your intent is to "Create something to give away" you have now pierced the Hobby/Recreation/336 bubble and fully liable to all of part 107 rules and regulations.
It's NOT ABOUT MAKING MONEY people. It's much bigger than that. Obviously "making money" and "furthering of a business" is one path to pierce the 336 protective bubble but there are many more.
If you are not flying 100% completely within the 336 bubble (and flying FOR someone else even as a good gesture is not hobby/recreational) then you default to a Civil Operation. Civil operations are anything outside of 336 and include: Making Money, Flying for your work, Search & Rescue (SAR), and doing anything that is not 100% hobby/recreational. I repeat you can NOT Hobby/Recreational for another person.
One key difference is if you want to shoot this for your own personal enjoyment and for your own person viewing later that's fine. But if you are doing it to create something to give to someone else you are outside of your protective bubble. The line had to be drawn somewhere and regardless where it's drawn we will always find "Exception" to the rule but that's our problem. The law is clear on this and it's codified as such.
It's NOT ABOUT MAKING MONEY people. It's much bigger than that. Obviously "making money" and "furthering of a business" is one path to pierce the 336 protective bubble but there are many more.
If you are not flying 100% completely within the 336 bubble (and flying FOR someone else even as a good gesture is not hobby/recreational) then you default to a Civil Operation. Civil operations are anything outside of 336 and include: Making Money, Flying for your work, Search & Rescue (SAR), and doing anything that is not 100% hobby/recreational. I repeat you can NOT Hobby/Recreational for another person.
One key difference is if you want to shoot this for your own personal enjoyment and for your own person viewing later that's fine. But if you are doing it to create something to give to someone else you are outside of your protective bubble. The line had to be drawn somewhere and regardless where it's drawn we will always find "Exception" to the rule but that's our problem. The law is clear on this and it's codified as such.
Look at it from an insurance point of view. If you don't have commercial insurance (which I assume you don't) then do you think that your hobby insurance would cover you to film the event, heaven forbid something went wrong. Also if the venue have any experience then they would ask to see your permission for commercial operations and insurance, which you wouldn't have. John.
So if a kid wants to take some video of his friends at the local skate park and share it with them on YouTube, he needs to have his Part 107? If a friend asks his neighbor for a sunset shot the next time she's out flying they need a Part 107?
You're correct that it's not about the money, it's about the intent. You make it sound like anything that is shared or viewed outside of the recreational pilot's personal use could be considered a commercial application. I don't believe that this was the intent of what the FAA deemed to be a commercial application and taking some video at a cousin's wedding certainly wouldn't count, as long as the intent to share without gain was the underlying factor.
Do you have permission from the venue to film on their property? Have you got the permission in writing? You said you will stay 50 meters away in case you loose control and don't want to be sued.wow thats some risk. Have you done a risk assessment? Site visit? Checked airspace, Notams or are you just going to turn up and throw it in the air hoping for the best?
Personally I would leave it at home and enjoy the day. Good luck though if you decide to ignore the advice.
Personally I would leave it at home and enjoy the day. Good luck though if you decide to ignore the advice.
If you do something for someone else, as in your intent is to DO Something for Someone Else, you are outside of the Hobby/Recreation bubble.
Youtube is different in terms of sharing. Your Youtube can be defined as for your enjoyment. But making a video FOR someone is not the same. Apples to bananas there.
And yes technically if a kid wants to operate a sUAS in the National Airspace System and shoot video FOR someone else (outside of his personal enjoyment) he would need to be under Part 107. But there's a caveat in that one because there is a Min age for Part 107.
As I stated above no matter where the line was drawn in the sand someone is going to question it and this only proves that point. Plain and simple. We could debate this with What If THIS and What if THAT all day long but the OP's question is not Hobby/Recreation.
I suggest anyone who is asking this type of question contact your local FSDO and get their input on the matter. Regardless of your/my/their resume on here it's the FSDO who is going to come knocking IF they get the complaint. The odds of this being a concern to the FAA is very minuscule but the question has been asked none the less.
rec·re·a·tion·al
ˌrekrēˈāSH(ə)n(ə)l/
adjective
adjective: recreational
relating to or denoting activity done for enjoyment when one is not working.
ˌrekrēˈāSH(ə)n(ə)l/
adjective
adjective: recreational
relating to or denoting activity done for enjoyment when one is not working.
You can't hobby/recreational FOR someone else.
Do you really think that if we can't volunteer our time, equipment, and services to look FOR someone lost in the wilderness (SAR) because it's not hobby that it would be ANY different shooting a wedding FOR someone? You see the intent is FOR SOMEONE ELSE! That's what excludes you from Section 336.
As I stated call you FSDO and propose the question to them exactly as the OP did and get their input. That's the only one that matters... PERIOD!
First, I would totally take notice of BigA107's expert knowledge. Many people fall foul of the law and regulations every day - people that nobody would call "criminals" but whom nevertheless end up in court (and usually lighter of wallet or purse as a result). It doesn't make headline news on TV or in the national newspapers, but talk to anyone familiar with the courts, police, or lawyers and they will confirm how frequently this happens. Ignorance is never a defence.
IF the idea went ahead, you would need an ample supply of ear plugs for all the guests.
I have never done wedding photography, but those that do nowadays offer an additional charge for using silent cameras - with a decent take-up. And we're just talking eliminating a rather low level of click, click, click from a DSLR here - not exactly as loud as the "angry buzzing" of a drone even from 50m away.
Brides (and grooms, on behalf of their "offended" beloved) have been known to turn vicious towards hotel and other venue managers because of rain falling on their precious day. Seriously. It happens more than you might think and such bizarre behaviour is on the increase. The hype (and expense) of a wedding is commonly OTT, with a corresponding crash just waiting to happen when something "goes wrong" or the self-obsessive emotion boils over.
And anyone in business knows to be very wary of mixing business and pleasure, even with those you've known for years.
IF the idea went ahead, you would need an ample supply of ear plugs for all the guests.
I have never done wedding photography, but those that do nowadays offer an additional charge for using silent cameras - with a decent take-up. And we're just talking eliminating a rather low level of click, click, click from a DSLR here - not exactly as loud as the "angry buzzing" of a drone even from 50m away.
Brides (and grooms, on behalf of their "offended" beloved) have been known to turn vicious towards hotel and other venue managers because of rain falling on their precious day. Seriously. It happens more than you might think and such bizarre behaviour is on the increase. The hype (and expense) of a wedding is commonly OTT, with a corresponding crash just waiting to happen when something "goes wrong" or the self-obsessive emotion boils over.
And anyone in business knows to be very wary of mixing business and pleasure, even with those you've known for years.
As always, BigAl, the voice of reason. Thank you. On a related note, please tell me the minimum age for Part 107 is something like 50 or 60, PULL-EASEEEE?
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So with what everyone is saying here is. Lets say my daughter is having some sort of party/event and asks me her dad to bring my drone and film some of it for her. Your saying i can not do it and it would be against the law and i should not do it. I would not be doing it for profit or for anything but recreation and to capture something for my daughter.
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Exactly my point... No way in hell that the FAA will come and take me to jail. It is family and no business here.
